How to efficiently manage new grammar (and a bit of self reflection)

[spiral]

Everyone learns at a different pace, I know that I am a snail. But maybe I’m going too slow.
I often see people learning 20+ grammar points a day, completing wanikani in a few months, learning 1000 kanji in a day (ok maybe not this quick). Meanwhile I find myself struggling with a few new grammar points a week.

I work full time, but still am able to dedicate 2-3 hours a day to studying, my motivation has been high for a long time and while I’m not demotivated by my lack of progress it can get frustrating when even basic sentences are a struggle.

While I always complete my reviews, I just struggle to learn new grammar points or vocab regularly. I don’t want to add more to the mix until I’ve got a better grasp of what I have already been taught. Some pages I feel like I have read 100 times, reread the sentences and listened to the examples, then when it comes up again next time I stare blankly as if I’ve never seen it before…

My question is really, should I be adding more onto my pile even if I haven’t grasped previously grammar? If I am learning 5 grammar points a day, but it takes me a week or more to start to understand, is that fine?

I’m learning alone and maybe the slowest learner in history, but highly motivated even through my struggles. This is my first post on any learning community, and hopefully a step in the right direction. Apologies for the semi rant

[jamiel]

Just keep going at a comfortable pace or you will overwhelm yourself and lose the motivation.

It is good that you are still adding a couple new grammar points a week which means you are making progress, even if it doesn’t feel like it.

It’s a marathon not a sprint.

The grammar points you struggle with, just pick one a day to go deeper into some content and re-do the examples and it will stick eventually.

Keep enjoying yourself.

Good luck!

[thelizard]

Find your own pace.

If you can dedicate 2-3 hours a day, that’s what you can dedicate. That’s probably more than most other people can dedicate. It took me a sec as well to figure out that I’ll have to do workload-amount compromises.

I barely manage 3 new grammar points a day. So on days that are too busy, or I don’t have the time? I don’t add any. Or maybe just one. I would like to do 20 new words a day, but no chance. If I do, my SRS-1 queue just increases and increases because they become too many and won’t stick. So what’s the solution? I skip a couple of days of adding new stuff until it flattens a little.

I like to be focussed at work. So I tend to dedicate one day a week, the Thursday in my case, to all my in-person meetings at work. It’s usually a very long day because of that. So most of the weeks, on Thursdays, I don’t have the energy to do much. I do the bare-minimum reviews and add nothing. A free Saturday with nothing to do? Cool, +30 vocab today it is, and then I review them hourly until they stick.

(the Thursday dilemma)

OK so other people speedrun N1 in a year, it will probably take me 10 years. It doesn’t matter. I’m happy for people who have the capacity, the time and the motivation to speedrun it. It’s not the benchmark that should matter. I simply can’t go at that speed and if I try, it backfires.

For every speed runner on the internet, there’s hundreds of people who probably go slower than we do anyway. They’re just not that vocal about it.

You’ll get there!

[LucasSerafim]

You´re are not the slowest, believe me.
I struggle to get my 2 grammar points a day meta done ^^’.
The important to me is to keep on progressing, even if it´s slow. Eventually you will be able to ajust the pace. Don´t risk losing your motivation based on what the “fast leaners” can acomplish.

Maybe one day I will get to 5 grammar points a day like you ^^

頑張ってください

[spiral]

I’m not doing 5 a day, was just wondering if I should up to 5 a day!

But thanks all, this is what I wanted to hear Sometimes seeing all the posts from the fast learners can grind me down, but I will keep plodding along. I hope to use these message boards more often from now on.

[JamesBunpro]

I have seen a fair number of threads about going fast or going slow since I started learning Japanese. Here is something to consider. If you do 1 grammar point and 10 vocab a day then you will hit the end of N1 after about two and a half years. Even if we round up to three years, that is still faster than the majority can handle. In fact, most people give up well before that point, especially if they have a job and responsibilities! So, my advice is to choose a pace that works for you and just keep going. As I often say, the main reason people don’t get good at Japanese is that they give up. Just don’t give up and you’ll get there far faster than all those that do!

[thelizard]

Bunpro has been around for a while. Have you guys ever compiled a stat of how long the average user needs to go from start to completed N1 amongst those who don’t give up? I’m curious

[FullMetalAlba]

The truth is that the people that are actually hitting N1 in those timelines are an extreme minority while most users are tapping away at a few grammar points a week (I would also like to see stats on this honestly).

It’s just that the posts where people are flexing their progress get the most attention because it’s clickbait for everyone, including me at times, that want a quick solution to learn.

Learning a language takes a lot of time and work and speedrunning JLPT doesn’t always translate to fluency. I wouldn’t put much stock in those kinds of posts and just go at you’re own pace. I also have a full time job so only stick at about 3 a day - you’re doing great

[Telechronn]

There is no such thing as too slow unless you have some sort of mandatory deadline. Learning Japanese when you don’t “have to” is akin to any other hobby: you do it often as you feel like or can and make progress at that rate. Don’t compare yourself to others with different goals and commitments.

[Yuemie]

You shouldn’t be too hard on yourself! I totally get what you mean by “others are faster,” but you have to consider that they might not have the same job, schedule, or energy level as you. The fact that you dedicate 2–3 hours a day to Japanese, on top of working full-time, is honestly amazing.

I struggle with grammar too. What helps me is taking notes or making a small deck for tricky points and doing focused review/crams. You can also write example sentences and keep them nearby — or add them to Bunpro’s self-study section.

I’d suggest making those grammar points personal — talk about your life, routines, or even your favorite anime, games, or food. Using grammar to express things that matter to you makes it easier to remember and more fun to practice.

ChatGPT can help too — it can explain grammar, make example sentences, or correct ones you’ve written.

Others on the forum might be able to explain things in a way that clicks better for you — or maybe a tandem partner could give you some extra practice and perspective. (There might even be a thread or help section for that already!)

You could also try a different grammar deck on Bunpro — they’ve got quite a few, and maybe you’ll even find a new one you like!

Right now, it might help to focus on making those tricky grammar points more memorable — or maybe even adjust your 2–3 hour study routine (no offense meant!). Do you study in one long session, or break it up throughout the day? Sometimes shorter, spaced sessions help more with grammar. Maybe on your way to work you can look into them (when you take the bus or so).
(I personally used to study non-stop without breaks, but now I go about 15 minutes, then take a short break to see if I’ve actually remembered anything — then move on to something new/ or take a longer break and review it later. That helps me personally… but I still have that one grammar that keeps messing with me )

I would also try to figure out whether writing sentences down (you can also us the thread “Have you written your sentence yet”), saying them out loud, or reading them (Bunpro has reading practice, or you could use ChatGPT) works best for memorizing them! Maybe even try explaining the grammar to someone else — imagine someone’s right next to you, and you’re trying to explain the topic as simply as possible. (maybe that will help?)

Once the noisy grammar parts start feeling smoother, you can totally add more to your daily queue if you feel up to it! It’s great to know your own limits! I’m sure as soon as those noisy grammar parts are mastered, they’ll never mess with you again.

• quick edit: Someone in the " Japanese SRS for children? - suggested marugoto online. They even offer grammar, pratices, kanji and so on.

[dyeray]

@spiral

Meanwhile I find myself struggling with a few new grammar points a week.

The pace of any sane language class would be to reach A2, which I believe is more or less N5 (plus the equivalent listening and speaking part, which noken lacks so many japanese learners ignore) in about 200 hours (plus what you study on your own, which depends on the person). And take into account most languages are way simpler than japanese. This usually is spaced during 2 years.

It’s not the same to learn and interiorize a language than to optimize solving a very narrow type of exercise, so don’t worry about those things. I’ve always said that in a real class, nobody would treat grammar as separate points to be learnt individually, and of course you would not be expected to learn a new grammar concept every day.

For reference, I’ve just finished first year Russian, which is level A2.1 and I have written down on Anki 13 grammar notes. I’m finishing second year of Japanese and we are going to take Noken N5 in december (got 43 grammar notes for now). I studied 3 years of german and I’d say I had a low B1 level written, probably more a high A2 speaking.

In the end vocabulary is a far bigger part of a language than grammar, and grammar cannot be memorized, you need time to interiorize it, so really, don’t worry.

[edwadl]

I’m part of the minority that doesn’t really ever post (this is probably my 2nd post in the 5.5 months I’ve started my learning lol). FWIW, I’m 112 days into BP and have 158 points studied ( just getting into N4 now ) and having spent about a month over on a different grammar platform prior to BP. I too read a bunch of progress posts and made my goal to do 5 grammar points a day. The 5 then became 3, then 1, then just reviews and the occasional 1 as I was getting overwhelmed and it was hard having things stick.

Having spent a good amount of time on reviews and catching up, I’ve again started up 2 points a day which is a good pace for me. I notice a pattern of getting ghosts on the new lessons, but they tend to go away with repetition and overall I’m happy to be progressing that completion bar, akin to exposure.

My main focus currently is WK and I try to “speed run” it as fast as what works for me. I do get doubts every now and then about dropping WK and completely moving my kanji/vocab learning over to Anki as it feels like I would save time overall. However, the WK method clicks for me and in the long run, I feel the kanji learning will aid in my ability to read(which I imagine will be my main method of learning after these resources) so I stick with it since the time frame to finish WK is reasonable enough for me. Once I finish WK, I can prioritize BP and slowly mine vocab in Anki. I can dedicate around 1-2 hours a day with work / life and there are certainly days ( especially the WK level up days ) which are quite brutal. I have some short term goals which I’m motivated to hit, but I will decrease my load similar to what I’ve done with grammar if needed so that I don’t burn out.

Why am I sharing this? I wanted to share my learning approach and maybe that will help you get a better picture of yours. The important thing is to find what works for you with the time you have. Have a plan on what you want to achieve (Specific, Measurable, Achievable, Relevant, and Time-bound ). It’s hard at times to accept that you might not be on the most optimal learning path but it beats having unnecessary stress, all for the sake of min-maxing when the effects are not as impactful as you might think when taking a step back to look at the bigger picture of your learning journey. Chip away and you will find fulfillment looking back at your accomplishments with time

[jrmr50]

At my top velocity, I was doing 1 new grammar point a day. Before that it was probably 3 a week. It’s no coincidence that the grammar I struggle the most with, is the ones that I rushed through.