Disambiguating と、や、とか、など

Grammar Points
#1

Recently I have been confusing these grammar points on my reviews, due to their similarity. Although its possibly just the way my brain works, but I find it helps to have a clear distinction between them, to avoid confusion. So I made little list to put in my notes…

と：shows a complete list.
例文：お茶とコーヒー があります (There is tea and coffee).

や：shows an incomplete list.
例文：お茶やコーヒー があります There is tea, coffee… (and possibly other beverages).

とか：does not necessarily imply a list, but implies that there things similar
例文：お茶とかコーヒー があります。 There is tea or coffee (or something similar to those).

など：shows related examples, which can also apply to incomplete lists
例文：お茶やコーヒーなどがあります。 There is tea, coffee… (and possibly other similar beverages).

What are your thoughts? Is this a safe way to think of these, or is there a better distinction to be made? I just want to be safe and not dig myself into a hole, by learning something incorrect. ^_^’

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#2

Absolutely not an expert here, but I kind of feel like や is used when you are trying to list all things, but just don’t want to/remember all the things that are in the list.

At the party there was tea, coffee, water, orange juice… some other stuff too idk.

While for など, I think it is kind of assumed that the listener knows what the other options are, so you don’t think it is necessary to list them all.

Some hot beverages are tea, coffee, gluhwein, etc.

That’s just how I feel about it though, might be completely wrong.

#3

Did know what this was until I looked it up, looks interesting!

I would just add that とか has a wider application with verbs and phrases. BP has snagged me on the “for example” or “among others” questions.

I took this as a brief list of examples by the speaker to get their point across. rather than the listener knowing the other options. Am I wrong?

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#4

I agree with your list but would also like to add something. I often used to get told off by friends for using など because it comes across as a bit formal. So yeah など fits in quite nicely with ます.

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#5

Cheers for the feed back guys, this puts my mind as ease. And thank you @matt_in_mito, I was unaware など had a formal connotation!

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#6

@deltacat3 Great list! This gives me an idea on how to improve our related grammar section. Cheers!

That brings back memories of my wife always getting on me about using など when speaking. Definitely stick with とか in conversational Japanese.

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#7

I think we mean the same thing here. I meant that with the given examples, the listener knows what other things that fit in the category are, so they don’t have to list them all.

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