ように～てほしい - Grammar Discussion

[Pushindawood]

Want ~ to ~ like ~
Want ~ to be able to ~
Want ~ to ~ in the way of ~

Structure

• Verb + ように + Verb[ て ]・ ほしい
• Noun + の ように + Verb[ て ]・ ほしい

[ように〜てほしい → Someone wants someone else to be able to~/~in the way of・ように〜たい → Someone wants to be able to ~/~in the way of]

View on Bunpro

[JT421]

I guess I didn’t read the english closely enough so I got the answer wrong.

But for my own gratification, Does ブラジルのように負けたくない at least mean “I don’t want to lose like Brazil”?

[matt_in_mito]

Does ブラジルのように負けたくない at least mean “I don’t want to lose like Brazil”?

Yes

[Johnathan-Weir]

Can this be used with みたいに instead?

[CrisH]

Would 「このアプリが役に立つようになりたい」 mean “I want to be useful like this app”? Or maybe “I want to become in the way of this app usefully”? I realise (now) that になりたい is inappropriate here, though.

[mrnoone]

@CrisH
「このアプリが役に立つようになりたい」sounds a bit unnatural.

“I want to be useful like this app” is:
このアプリのように役立ちたい。
このアプリのように、役立つ人になりたい。
このアプリのように、人の役に立ちたい。

I hope it helps,
Cheers!

[CrisH]

Thanks. Is 役立つ interchangeable with 役に立つ or are they used in slightly different ways?

[mrnoone]

@CrisH
Hey and sorry for the late answer!
They are completely interchangeable. Cheers

[Raecchi]

I keep getting tripped up by this example sentence 「どの (ようにかいてほしい)ですか」because I keep trying to use ほう instead of よう. I know it’s not the grammar being tested, but is it completely incorrect? (And if so, can someone explain why?) Thanks!

[mrnoone]

@Raecchi
Hey and welcome on the community forums!

どのほう is not used, however you can use:

• どのような方法(ほうほう！）で
• どんなやり方(かた）で
• どういう風（ふう）に
• どうやって
  instead

I hope it helps,
Cheers

[Chiinox]

I have a question about the example sentence
" ブラジルのように負けて欲しくない" - “I don’t want you to lose like Brazil.”
The following sentence isn’t accepted:
" ブラジルのように負けなくて欲しい"

I’m wondering, does it change the meaning, or is it not grammatically correct? If so, why? Moving the negative from ほしい to 負ける. In English it’d be the difference between “I want you to not lose” / “I don’t want you to lose” which is basically the same thing.

[IcyIceBear]

Opposite meaning the way I see it. (If it’s grammatically correct I’m not sure)

The correct answer
“I don’t want you to lose like Brazil”
ブラジルのように負けて欲しくない like Brazil, lose, don’t want

The one you tried
“I want you to not lose, like Brazil”
ブラジルのように負けなくて欲しい like Brazil not lose, want

The first, Brazil lost and I don’t want you to be like them

The second, Brazil didn’t lose, and I want you to be like them

[nekoyama]

@Chiinox

負けなくて欲しい

This should be 負けないで欲しい.

As for the difference in nuance…

@日本語文型辞典

There are two negative forms of V-てほしい: V-ないでほしい and V-てほしくない. As in the case of example (5), V-ないでほしい is often used in place of V-ないでください, when asking the other person not to do V. V-てほしくない can be used in two situations: when the speaker states his wish that does not affect the listener as in the case of example (6), or when the speaker is criticizing the listener’s action as in the case of (7).

[Jerfy]

I’m confused about this example sentence.

弁護士になれるように頑張ってほしい。

I want you to work your hardest, so that you can become a lawyer.

Isn’t that different to the “like” meaning? It feels more like “in order to”. I asked ChatGPT and it said that there is two meanings for 様に, but I went backed to check 様に grammar, and it said nothing about a “in order to” meaning. So I’m not really trusting ChatGPT.

I’m not quite getting it. I appreciate any help!

[casual]

There is more than one ように on Bunpro, and it seems that this point (N4 lesson 6) comes earlier than “in order to” ように (JLPT N4) | Bunpro (N4 lesson 10).

[Jerfy]

Oh shoot! I haven’t gotten to that one yet. This makes sense then. Thanks for the clarification!!