N5 L2 Reading Discussion

This is a discussion topic for the N5 Lesson 2 reading passages.

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The furigana for 二人 says “ににん” not “ふたり”.

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Yes! I have just seen it! 二人 should be read as ふたり.

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@rwmleach @Christophegand
Sorry for the late answer! (for some reason this part of forum was muted)
I have fixed the error!

Cheers!

Notes for the first text have anotations 2 and 3, but I cannot see those in the text.

PS: Oh, I see those notes are on the english translation, sorry.

I didn’t really undersatand the notes for this one. Are they saying the name Sam wouldn’t be used so frequently in real Japanese text )in which case why did they put it in?). Or something else?

The point, which is a very important one, is that you don’t need to repeat names or even the subject (he/she) once it’s been established. Phrasing of the note could be a tiny bit better I suppose, but it’s basically saying that unless the subject being discussed changes, you don’t need to explicitly reference it.

The passage is simplified for the sake of beginner reading, but as you see more sentences you will see how sometimes it seems like a sentence is incomplete because the sentence didn’t state what it was talking about. In this case, the previous sentence set the tone and setting, and since the second sentence didn’t alter that subject, there was no reason to think it could be about anyone else.

That was probably a horrible explanation sorry LOL someone can probably make it better than me but it really is something you’ll notice if you keep doing the readings on here. Good question!

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Is there any difference between 父とテレビ見ます。and テレビ父と見ます。?

The latter of the two テレビ父とみます doesn’t sound natural :+1:

What is な part of これはヒルトンとリッツカールトンなんです。? I clicked on the link which led me to のです and noticed noun + な + んです. But, な link went to な adjective. There’s no adjective in the sentence, just two nouns (Hilton & Ritz-Calton)?

You’re correct. There’s no adjective but な is used to connect nouns to んです.
@Jake I’m not sure that link to な is intended?

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So would a more natural set of sentences be something like:

サムはおとこです。かれ 高校生こうこうせいなんです。

Or would you even take out the は and have something like:

サムはおとこです。高校生こうこうせいなんです。

Yeah! Because these are super simplistic sentences that use limited grammar, the flow is a little wonky but that’s precisely correct. Because no other subject has been introduced or inferred, it’s correct to assume the subject remains サム here so there’s no need to point out their gender/name. You’ll see in future example sentences/reading passages this same concept but with more natural flowing sentences.

A content team member can jump in here to correct me if I’m wrong, but yeah you’re on the right page! It’s a super common initial point of confusion for people haha. Feel free to keep asking any more questions! :cowboy_hat_face:

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@eclipse77x
As @EdBunpro has said, since it is correct to assume that Sam is the subject, pointing out their name or gender is not necessary.

However, in this example, omitting the subject sounds awkward and unnatural because it ends with なのです. The reason why it sounds unnatural (at least for me) is because なのです is used for emphasis or to explain something that you know is a fact, and omitting the subject that なのです is emphasizing makes the sentence sound awkward. However, omitting 彼は would sound completely natural if it ended with です.

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@EdBunpro I’ve been working at being able to write those natural flowing sentences. For the most part I can understand what I read, and I have a good vocabulary and knowledge of grammatical structures, but I get stuck on writing longer passages, like a journal entry for example. I’ve seen many good explanations on particular vocabulary and/or grammatical structures, but not as much when it comes to putting it all together. I expect I will get better at it the more I read. I also might be completely overthinking it.

@Fuga I think if I were to have written something like that I may have tried to write it this way:

サムはおとこで、キャンディスはおんなです。
二人とも高校生こうこうせいなのです。

In the second sentence it would not be necessary to mark the subject since we were just discussing Tom and Candace, right? Would 男性・女性 work here or would it sound too formal or unnatural?

My language skills aren’t that good, so I totally relate to struggling with longer sentences when first coming across them. It sounds generic, but over time as you continue to read more and more, you’ll start to come across very typical patterns that prolong sentences. The grammar points in N4 in particular (along with N5 too!) will gradually introduce these points, and the reading passages should do a pretty decent job at getting you some more exposure. While the difficulty will be initially pretty tough, the thread here on the forums called “Haruna’s Daily Diary” will be some GREAT practice at long sentences. Even if you’re not able to parse much of the content at first, I think the exposure will be good to come back to every now and again.

But yeah, long story short, staying consistent will eventually make this stuff more manageable without a doubt. I don’t think you’re overthinking it at all - it really helps to have an open mind, especially in the beginning in my opinion. Constantly asking questions and trying (+ failing!) new things is how you’ll really begin to make progress and enjoy learning the language a lot more.

@EdBunpro Definitely looking forward to practicing more N3 and N2 material. I’ve been studying Japanese in some form or another for the past twenty years. Just last December I passed the N4, and this week I reached Level 60 on WaniKani.

I was doing an N3 course on Udemy (since the N4 course I did last year helped me so much) but I think the N4 course was more of a review of things I already know. I needed a lot more practice on the N3 grammar that the course did not offer. And so, Bunpro!

When I first started Bunpro I tried jumping in at the N3 level but I was having a hard time figuring out exactly what the questions were asking for and what kind of responses I was supposed to be providing. So I went all the way back to N5 to get a better feel for how things are structured.

I will check out Haruna’s Daily Diary and see how much of it I can understand. Reading long passages I can do, it’s writing them I have trouble with. I’ve always been really good at picking up languages, but as a writer I’m so comfortable with English and I can’t really use other languages to express myself with that kind of eloquence. YET! And thank you for the warm welcome!

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Okay, a quick question, for the part discussing Candice. I see that you don’t need to use her name in the second sentence, but the sentence is using the particle "も” which is operating as “also” in this context. If we wanted to, could we still use the も particle but without the subject?

As in: 「も高校生です。」 instead of 「キャンヂイスも高校です。」

I’m not a native speaker or a teacher, but I think that even if Candice’s name was not used in the second sentence something would still need to be included to identify WHO the speaker is saying is “also a high school student”—like 「彼女かのじょも高校生です。」

The english would look like: “Candice is a girl. She is also a high school student.” If it was “Candice is a girl. Also a high school student.” the second sentence would be incomplete. (Although in many cases the two languages have quite different sets of rules, so this may not be the best example.)

@Fuga what do you think?

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As @eclipse77x has mentioned, if the particle も was used, the subject will need to be included. The Japanese sentence would sound as unnatural as the English translation.

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